lol, omg plot twists that ruin fan-created couples

[HeXXus]

kind of a rant/laughing at what happened. As well as a place for you to vent if something similar or something else kind of like it has happened to you.

I like making fan characters and writing fanfiction almost as much as I love doing the same for original stuff. ( Fanfiction may not get me anywhere, but it's fun, and it helps me find a way to fix my flawed writing style before I dare try any original projects.)

Normally...I'm not -too- hung up on pairings, I mean I can write something original or fanfiction without them. I try them every so often, and normally in the case of fanfiction, I go for fancharacterxfancharacter, as...some people go utterly crazy if you try to pair off with a canon and start screaming mary-sue.

fancharxcanon I do like reading, so I'd like to try it- I tried it once before in another fandom, but then I kind of tore myself away from it. I don't know, I guess I didn't like it- and when I thought it wasn't overused, DA proved me wrong. So I got bored with it and just decided 'nah'.


But there is this one fancharxcanon pairing I wanted to attempt. While there probably are others out there doing the same with said canon, I hadn't seen much of it, and there were characters people loved far more. I even had a weird, cute way to approach it- with the gal being too shy to tell the oblivious dude, but somehow made it clear eventually.

So what is my problem you ask?

WELL- this show hadn't been on for months, and saturday the season three premiere movie was shown...and you know how DTV sequels throw in love interests out of nowhere? This was worse.

At least with the love interest canons out of nowhere, you can pretend they broke up, or it never happened and still not ruin canon or anything.

What happened in this movie, was the canon FREAKING DIED.

It was just like, out of nowhere. o3o I have known for a while, after watching this show that they pull out plot twist after plot twist, but I ..Never saw this coming. Spoilers indicated a canon character was going to die, but I never thought it was going to be him.

lol, it's just kind of funny to me/annoying at the same time.

It's like, the one fandom I WANT to attempt a fancharxcanon pairing for, so dang typical that the canon character ends up kicking the bucket. xD

And he's definitely dead. robot crushed into cube, cube thrown into incinerator- no coming back from that. So now, I can't do that pairing. ;____: SOOO TYPICAL. My favorite characters always die, so I should have seen this coming.


I suppose I could always do another in the fandom sometime, but I kind of liked that one. > : And the fanchar will be all ' *DEPRESSED* in the game of luuurve.



lol, so you gals ever had this happen to you? I know the DTV official love interest has happened to at least one of you, but have you ever tried to make a fancharxcanon pairing only to have the canon die in the actual fandom?

[FaPingMulan]

Man I hate it when my favorite characters die too, it's awful. But since you asked I have never really had any problems that ruined my fan-characters before. Except for people being really mean about my fan-characters it hurts my feelings. I mean there are a lot of disney movies where the child looks a lot like the parent and not all of them are animal movies either I mean Melody looks exactly like Ariel except her hair is a different color and she keeps it back in a pony tail. My characters were created that way too but their personalities are completely different making them not mary-sues in my opinion. But I suppose I am getting off the subject the only thing lately besides that is that my two favorite oc's Kia (Kayley's daughter) and Kai (Mulan's daughter) are me divided into two of my different personality traits there's kia who is kind and sweet and Kai who can kick your butt if you make her angry. But I played Kia lost her parents who were killed and the next day my cat my very best friend died now I am hesistant with anything I play of kia now, ironic huh?

[Nilla Joy]

Hmmph! This is the most interesting topic I ever answer, but since you brought it up, I shall answer too. HOORAY HOORAY! XDD

Ahem...anyway! I personally wouldn't know from a experience what it's like to have a favorite character from a movie died permantly but there has been some close calls from my own favorites. But what I CAN tell you is, I know what it's like to lose a really great cool character off to a really bad love interest they throw in for the sequels because that's a serious topic everyone relates to, but that's ONLY if they understand what it's like.

I've switch my way to supporting offical shippers to officals and OCs after stupid Disney and Sony Pictures made Kenai/Nita and Elliot/Giselle possible in the Brother Bear and Open Season sequels grrrr!

The people who are behind those corny DTV sequels are just doing it for money. It's not very creative unless there's a good chance for a really good story behind it! I don't care what the other people must say about this, but they shouldn't be calling the others Mary-Sues or whatever cause that just flushes all of our creative hard work down the toliet.

[FaPingMulan]

Somehow I knew you were gonna bring up the fact of characters getting with someone else not that I blame you it tends to make me upset too. And I agree that it does flush all our creative work down the toliet

[nightworm]

I remember when I predicted that Sirius, one of my all top favorite Harry Potter characters, was going to die. This happened, I think, before the fifth book came out. Still, when the book came out and I read it...I nearly cried. I couldn't believe he was really dead but I think I was getting to know Rowling's mind a bit well by that time and Sirius' death seemed inevitable.

So far, Sirius is the only fictional character that I think I truly miss. But then, when Eddie died and almost didn't come back in the Dark Tower series, I nearly bawled. I know my librarian did! I don't think my creative mind's been dampened a bit though.

And what do you guys mean when your talking about Mary Sues? I've heard that term before with fanfiction. I' m afraid I have no idea what it means.

[Dusk Nightshade]

Aw man, fictional character deaths? I remember Sirius's death getting to me, especially since I thought it was done so lamely (an LJ icon I vaguely remember seeing mentioned something about "done in by a drapery"). But then, a lot of people do die in stupid ways (see the Darwin Awards for some truly special ones). Well, at least I got some good fanfic to read out of it (my favourite is a "bring Sirius back" story--it's got a bit of Sirius/Remus in it, so I dunno if you'll like it--and another story managed to turn it into a crossover with Yuugiou! that actually worked pretty well).

I bawled like a baby at the end of The Masterharper of Pern--I love the Pern books and reread them often, but so far I haven't been able to reread that one. It's just too sad! He was one of the best characters ever...

And then there's my favourite character's death in the Season 2 finale of Primeval... the LJ Primeval fandom (specifically, Primeval Denial--Where the bad things didn't happen) also came up with "fix-it" stories--some of them are really creative--but still. I should've known he was doomed when he became my favourite... And I think I'll stop there before I start listing all of my dead favourite characters haha.

And what do you guys mean when your talking about Mary Sues? I've heard that term before with fanfiction. I' m afraid I have no idea what it means.

A Mary Sue is a character who is absolutely perfect and all the canon characters love her--the girls want to be her, the boys want to date her--and the only people who don't like her are the ugly characters or the "bad" characters. Mary Sue is compassionate, kind, loves everyone, tries to redeem evil, and can do no wrong. If the series the fanfic is for has superpowers or magic or something, her powers will far outstrip the canon characters--she has to be the best at everything. If she has any flaws, they won't be real ones, like "she's too kind!" or "she too pretty". And let's not forget her "tragic past". A male Mary Sue is a Gary Stu, and those tend to have more of a "bad-ass" vibe--if only they weren't so annoying!

It is possible to write fanfiction featuring original characters or self-inserts (I'm not too fond of original characters, but I have read and linked to good ones before), but Mary Sues are what happens when the concept is done wrong. Very wrong. Probably because most people who write them tend to be young, and haven't written much yet. Though, I have heard some people like Mary Sue stories, so of course, your mileage may vary. (:

Oh my god, this post is huge. I feel mildly embarrassed now.

[nightworm]

Thank you for enlightening me on the Mary Sues subject Dusk Nightshade! Though I believe you have no reason to feel embarrassed, my good friend.

[Nilla Joy]

May 22, 2009 9:47:32 GMT -5 Dusk Nightshade said:

Probably because most people who write them tend to be young, and haven't written much yet. Though, I have heard some people like Mary Sue stories, so of course, your mileage may vary.

Young? I have to disagree with you Dusk Nightshade. Some people are very well gifted in writing fanfictions, so the age thing does not matter to them whether you're young or old to have perfect writing skills or a character that's not a Mary-Sue. In my views, a character is just a character. There are no Mary-Sues in my term.

Because that's like trying to tell someone that person sitting next to you in class is a loaf of retard, when clearly that's not even a real fact. Calling someone's character a Mary-Sue is like making fun of someone, if you know what I mean.

I'm sorry if I sound like I'm ranting, but I'm not. I'm just trying to clear out something about the writing thing you brought out.

[Dusk Nightshade]

Nilla Joy--
Oh no, that's not what I meant! Hmm. I probably should've made sure to state that was my opinion based on other opinions I've read about the topic.

Age/Writing--Some people are really good at writing from the beginning and others have to work at it a bit, no matter how old they are. Just because I can bang out a ten-page paper in a few hours and get an A on it, doesn't mean I'm good at writing at fiction. Or even communicating and explaining myself properly!

I don't quite see the connection between saying a character is a Mary Sue saying the person next to you is a retard, though the last is definitely quite mean (though in my experience, that doesn't stop some people; oh well). Oh, wait I think I see--and you're right, calling a character a Mary Sue doesn't mean it actually is one. The thing is, I guess this is a bit of a... uhm, "controversial" seems to be a bit strong/serious... "polarized"? "your-mileage-may-vary"? topic; people tend to have very strong opinions on this, and usually on completely opposite sides. At least, from what I've seen on ff.net and LJ (and maybe those two sites attract people with the same kind of opinions).

No worries, you didn't sound like you were ranting at all, just sharing a different opinion. It is very possible to share different opinions (which can lead to interesting conversations) and stay friendly!

[Suze]

LOL, oh goodness. I was really upset when my favorite megaman character was killed? (Not sure but it looked it he didn't survive) and when I was playing FF4 I mean I was upset about building up a strong team only to have so far 3 of them dead and one too mortally injured to fight. It made me sad.

[FaPingMulan]

I think I'll have to agree with Nilla Joy about Mary and Gary Sues, while I don't particularly think they exist I do tend to get annoyed when characters are all god mod and are all super powerful where they have no weaknesses and no one can defeat them and in my cousin's case where her character is the most beautiful girl and every guy including male villains want to get with her it gets annoying real fast

[Dusk Nightshade]

May 23, 2009 10:08:13 GMT -5 FaPingMulan said:

I think I'll have to agree with Nilla Joy about Mary and Gary Sues, while I don't particularly think they exist I do tend to get annoyed when characters are all god mod and are all super powerful where they have no weaknesses and no one can defeat them and in my cousin's case where her character is the most beautiful girl and every guy including male villains want to get with her it gets annoying real fast

I completely agree with you--some characters are supposed to be annoying, but those characters are so beyond annoying, reading about them isn't fun anymore.

Oh dear, I've sort of managed to start an off-topic thread-hijacking here... I'm not sure if I should be proud of myself for participating enough to make this happen, or if I should be ashamed of my bad manners!



Attempt to get back on topic--
I don't usually read fanfic that pairs up fan characters and canon ones; I'm a pretty picky reader, and for the most part, I'm not too big on reading romance-focused stories in the first place. Anyway, when canon does evil things, I place my stories (in my head, I rarely write anything down) before the evil event happens, or try to come up with scenarios on how to bring the dead character back (lack of a corpse and certain shows gives lots of wiggle room for this), or how to alter events just enough to keep him alive after all (Primeval Denial, I love you). Of course, that makes the whole thing AU, since it won't fit canon anymore, which seems to be the point of this thread, but it's really hard to eat your cake and have it too. Unless you're a lot more creative and twisty-minded than I am.



I think people shouldn't let that stop them though; killing off creativity is such a waste.

[FaPingMulan]

Yes killing creativity is a total waste and I also tend to come up with random plot things to bring people back from the dead when I rp with my friends

[Nilla Joy]

May 24, 2009 20:05:26 GMT -5 FaPingMulan said:

Yes killing creativity is a total waste and I also tend to come up with random plot things to bring people back from the dead when I rp with my friends

Oh yes it's so fun to magically bring characters back to life after they have a short amount of death for a while lol because no one wants to see them die....unless they want them to stay permantly dead if it helps the story move on. I still pity myself for killing off one of my Ferngully characters in our last roleplay we did in March. Gulity as charge ^^;

[HeXXus]

xD lol wow, what discussions!
Man...canon loves to torture us with character deaths and character torment, doesn't it? EVIL. I know how you all feeel. lol so are you guys equally as worried every time you get attachted to a new character that they're going to die?

>> I...hehe...bawled too when sirius died. And I'd totally read a certain good fan fiction, even if it did have remus/sirius in it. I don't mind slash at all, provided it's done..decently. I do believe canonxfan character, even if I like how some people can get creative, can be done really badly and has a bad reputation because for some reason people don't like to remember or talk about the ones that were well-done, and instead focus is so driven on the bad ones, that it's all anybody associates that sort of pairing with. But I also believe there can be badly-done canonxcanon pairings, and I'm sad to say I must choose the worst slash fics to read- because a majority of the ones I've read have been...just two characters thrown together because they're both hot, and it's hot to have hot guys making out- bonus points if they're your favorites. ( I'm getting off topic now by wondering...why is it that a lot of male slash fans I've seen will say they're all for GAY LOVE, because it's true and pure- but only if it's males. And female/female slash is 'some sick guy's twisted fantasy'? I can't be the only person who has seen this. and if I had, boy do I need to read some better ones. )

But likewise, I've read good slash- of BOTH genders, so I can't say every single one I've read is bad. Ditto with canonxfanchar,.

personally I'm not a huge pairing person either. But I told myself that I wanted to do at least one canonxcanon pairing writing, and at least one canonxfanchar writing ( to try it.)

:F I normally choose the latter around the transformers fandom, because then I'm not obligated to go into mushy romantic details, because asexual robots are incapable of that. So it's more like flirty friendship? And I think I'm so hung up on people finding any fan characters, ( I call them fan characters. They can be original, I suppose, but as they cannot exist without certain fandoms, I'm reluctant to refer to them as such. ), of mine as mary sues- that I let that influence me greatly and thus am utterly incapable of doing fancharxcanon pairings even in a mild, non-heavy romance variety.

I guess years of people turning their noses up at anything with 'fan character' in it did it for me.
:F Haha, I'm really an odd person out in fan fiction community, because I tend to like fan characters ( provided they don';t suffer from 'too good to be true' syndrome).

I can't say for sure whether mine are or aren't mary sues or gary stus. But I try to work in realistic weaknesses, and only make them interact with what canons would be necessary for the story. I don't feel the need to have one interact with every single canon, and if I ever do fancharxcanon, which is rare- I look for a vague or minor background char- somebody who isn't the main focus of a fangirling community. XD; I figure that will...help me out more, because then people don't really give a rat's hat about that canon anyway, so if their perception is 'fancharacter equals badfic'- then they don't have to worry about me 'ruining' any of their favorite characters.

ANYWAY....BACK ON TOPIC.

Yeah, that's a decent idea. I mean, if you're putting a fan character in anyway, then it's automatically AU. But I'm really...nitpicky. xD Part of what I wanted to do was have a crush developed and then make the guy really oblivious to it and all 'wut? wut?' ( them being ROBOTS and all..)
Eh, it wasn't going to develop into anything major anyway, even considering all the limitations- as I disliked every male character finding blackarachnia hot in the cartoon despite her being my favorite character.

So, I guess this is canon's way of telling me.

'No Shauni. Not him. He's dead'

:F Hope was lost with the end of the series.

Ah well, happens. Maybe I'll do it with something else...at some point.

I'm not big into romance-based fics either. I don't mind them showing up here or there, but I tend to like action, humor, and conflict to show up more..So maybe it's for the best canon killed the character off? At most, maybe they would have had one chapter of ' <3 Hiii' and then that's it.

( Haha, what a great relationship. I'm a fairly unromantic person..)

lolol, whoops. now I've gone rambling. Sorry guys. Apparently I like to ramble at midnight.